Mar 2
How would you strengthen Utah’s democracy?
March 2, 2009 | Categories: General |
The Commission is just starting its work and is excited you hear your thoughts and ideas. Have you seen something that isn’t working? Do you have an innovative idea about how to increase voter participation? Please use the comment feature to share you ideas with the commission. They’ll be available for everyone to view!
Comments
27 Comments so far
I spent many of my 32 years as a reporter/editor covering Utah’s politics and, since retiring, I have been active in the Republican Party in Summit County, twice serving as a delegate to the Utah GOP State Convention. In that time I have determined the biggest roadblock to full democracy in Utah is the political party convention system. The existing system allows small groups to control the process, as we are seeing now with the selection of candidates to the State School Board. Virtually all of the new candidates are from the pro-voucher movement which was defeated in the 2007 general election by nearly two-thirds of Utah voters. But a pro-voucher school board can circumvent the will of the people. This is just one example. I support open primaries in all political races. And, if only one candidate files for the Republican or Democratic or Libertarian nomination, then that candidate would advance directly to the general election. And, if you have numerous candidates, then the person receiving the most votes in the primary would be that party’s general election candidate. I think the parties stll need to have their rules and platforms and support candidates, but I would end the nominating conventions. Additionally, the existing system creates an added financial burden on many candidates because now they have as many as three election cycles in one year. Thank you. If you wish more details, you have my e-mail address.
Charge each person who does not vote a $10 surcharge on their state taxes. Increase the amount by $5 dollars after each 2 year general election.
I think that voter turn out has been going down because people do not like to be labeled as a Republican, Democrat or Independent. Just a thought but if people could vote in primaries more would most likely turn out.
It is my observation, as an experienced elections official and political scientist, that there are two systemic issues that depress voter participation in the State of Utah.
The first issue is unnecessary barriers and obstacles in state law and currently proposed legislation regarding voter registration and maintenance of the accuracy of the voter registration rolls. Examples include restrictive registration deadlines, requirements that all updates to a voter’s record be initiated by the voter via a written registration form even though elections officials may have the voter’s correct information in their possession, requirement that voters provide additional information not required by federal law (place of birth and naturalization status and details)as well as by the current and proposed ID and proof of citizenship requirements.
The second issue is the lack of competitive contests and, related to it, the dearth of compelling candidates. Voters feel that, in Utah elections, the value of their vote is diminished by the easily predicted outcomes of most contests. While some of the lack of competitiveness might be attributed to legislative Gerrymandering, this is not an adequate explanation of one party dominance in the state. The absence of and official indifference to effective voter education programs by state and local governments contribute greatly to voter indifference and ignorance. Also not to be forgotten as a source of this voter cynicism is the inability of political parties to develop compelling platforms and positions and to field competitive candidates that can mobilize voters to participate.
Until these systemic issues are recognized by the parties, electeds, the media and community leaders (as well as this commission)and until multi-partisan, good faith attempts are made to address them; the work of this commission and other efforts to promote increased voter participation in Utah will remain mere platitudes.
I would suggest that Utah discontinue “MotorVoter” registration, and create a computerized system to insure that no one is registered in more than one county or precinct. In fact it would be good to clear the name of any voter that hasn’t voted in the past two presidential cycles.(eight years) There are probably tens of thousands of “ghost” voters on the rolls. There are also probably tens of thousands that checked the box when getting a driver’s license that have never voted, including thousands of illegal aliens that received a Utah Driver’s License prior to 2005.
Every year we hear of the low percentage turnout of registered voters in Utah. Since there are tens of thousands of registered voters that are registered in more than one county, moved from the state, are illegal aliens, have been registered for over a decade, but never voted, or some are very likely even dead. If the registration rolls were cleaned and MotorVoter discontinued we would see a large and immediate jump in the percentage of registered voters voting.
It doesn’t hurt for a citizen to have to make the tiny effort to register to vote. Generally a Utah driver’s license(not a driver’s privilege card) or Utah ID card should be enough. Treating voters like little children, needing to be enabled in every little thing is silly. If we are worried about these uninterested citizens and have to enable them, we may as well lower the voting age to 10 and let those in 5th grade and above vote. We would likely get better results.
Please post publicly the following question and the commission’s answers. Thank you.
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Who has been charged with moderating the comments and how were the moderators chosen.
What kinds of things will trigger rejection of a comment?
Will there be limits to how many comments a given individual can post?
I have two suggestions. First, the parties need to find a way to tone down the fringes of their parties. Changes need to be made to the caucuses such that the more radical elements have less sway. I attended last year’s state convention for the Utah Republican party and was appalled by the behavior of some groups. Previous to moving to Utah, I was a state delegate in Colorado and I assure you that the proceedings were far more civil and motivating. Both the left and the right have extreme elements who alienate the average voter. Second, I think we should move towards making each voter have a photo ID. This would greatly reduce the fear of voter fraud and thereby allow election officials to loosen some of the rules that inhibit participation. In conjunction with this change, all the polling places should be tied together electronically and once a voter has voted; all the polling locations should be updated such that the same person wouldn’t be able to go to another location and vote again. With this in place, people can vote closest to where they work instead of making arrangements to travel back to their precinct during the day or wait in line after work.
Unfortunately, voter apathy in Utah is an issue that needs to be addressed by those choosing not to exercise their civic right (in my humble opinion, responsibility) to vote.
While it is admirable that the Governor’s office is at least making a public issue out of low voter turnout, this isn’t something that belongs in the realm of a government agency. The Governor and Lieutenant Governor should have much more to worry about than addressing the issue of people choosing not to vote. If this is a commission funded by tax dollars, then it should be disbanded or reformed as a volunteer organization.
That being said, Utah’s system is in need of dramatic makeover. The convention system ensures that only those playing the game of “old-boy partisan politics” will ever see their name on a general election ballot. There are a number of rules and regulations involved in the voting process that just don’t make sense. Utah’s governmental inability to deal with fraud and corruption while regularly attempting to enforce the predominant view of morality upon the citizenry discourages weak-willed voters from participating. Voter education is not the responsibility of the government, it is the responsibility of the voter. We, as citizens, need to start being responsible for our own actions (or inaction) and accept that there are consequences to choosing not to vote.
Josh Ewing and Taylor Morgan are moderating. We have been fixing a few glitches in the website, but posts are now being moderated. No limits will be set on comments. Only lewd, inappropriate, vulgar, and spam comments will be rejected.
Ralph Wakley nailed the issue. “. . .I have determined the biggest roadblock to full democracy in Utah is the political party convention system. The existing system allows small groups to control the process. . .I support open primaries in all political races.”
I concur with Mr. Wakley. Because of the political party convention system, elected leaders do not represent or act in the best interest of their constituents, but rather, what will earn them the delegates’ vote. This alienates Joe Q. Public from the election process.
If there could be a “politically jaded” party, that would solve many problems. Many of the people that I know, myself included, feel that neither party has been able to produce a viable candidate for quite a while. I agree with a former comment that there are too many fringe candidates. The majority of the elected republican officials seem to get a kick out of how overly conservative they can be, and if they can surpass even the LDS church in conservatism, then they have got to be on the right track. Side note, I am an active member of the LDS church, and this is not an attack on the church. Then you have the SLC democrats who try to undermine the church on all counts. Gratefully, I don’t vote in that disaster of a district, but these are the candidates we ALL hear about. In order to find out anything about people who are running in your precinct, the voter has to do a ridiculous amount of work. The debates are rarely televised, or even reported on. The average democrat has really no chance of winning, so really they are just filling the other slot that no one even looks at because they haven’t ever even heard of this person. Here on the west side, the democrats, in my opinion, actually have put up some very good candidates. No one even heard of them. These people were actually what I would call republican in any other state. Instead, the republicans gave us first, Cannon. Enough said. Only to be replaced by Jason Chavetz! Why don’t we just give Utah a bigger black eye in congress? Like I said, we had no good choices on the republican side, and it was so hard to learn anything about any other candidates that of course they were going to win. All in all, the whole process is extremely frustrating for those of us who actually pay attention to what is happening politically. Another side note. I have been a republican for all of my voting life until the past few years when I have not registered for either party. So I am automatically excluded from the primaries. I am no longer a registered republican because the party gave me a hard time about not donating $500. I guess all republicans have an extra $500 laying around they don’t need.
Here are a few suggestions I have for improving the voting process:
1. Citizens should show a photo ID to verify their status as a citizen! No one should be allowed to vote without it!
2. More polling places for early voting.
3. Open primaries so all citizens can vote no matter what party they represent. I cross-party vote in various elections depending on the person or the issue.
4. More coverage of legislative issues by the newspapers while the legislature is in session. Only hot topic issues are showcased and ofttimes the same issue over and over again. A more conclusive summary would be nice and also an accounting of how legislators voted. I know the information is on line, but if the news gave more time and space for the majority of the bills, more people would read about it and become involved. Also, if the news shows devoted more time to what was happening, it would be more relevant. There is still a viable portion of the population that read their news in a newspaper and it appears to get “watered” down especially when the legislature is in session.
I do NOT want to strengthen our “democracy!” In the first place we are NOT a democracy. We never have been, nor do we want to be, unless you are a demagogue that wants to make yourself dictator! Democracies are only precursors to dictatorships. They don’t work or last, because they become mob rule. Everybody, whether they studied the issue or not, has a say, majority rules. Some big speaker comes along, preaches change, changes a few laws to keep themselves in power, and you end up with a Hitler.
We are a democratic republic. We elect leaders to deeply research and upon principles of good government to make laws that protect freedom and the minority, (because we will all be in the minority at some point). A republic is a much more stable and liberating model of government.
Why do we keep proclaiming our government to be something it is not? Why do we think we have to get everyone to vote? Countries who do this are much less stable than ours. Is it because one political party is trying to get the vote of those who don’t study the issues. Will they then become the demagogues?!
“We are a Republican Government. Real liberty is never found in despotism or in the extremes of Democracy.”
- Alexander Hamilton
“…democracies have ever been spectacles of turbulence and contention; have ever been found incompatible with personal security, or the rights of property; and have in general been as short in their lives as they are violent in their deaths.”
- James Madison
“The United States shall guarantee to every State in this Union a republican form of government…”
- U.S. Constitution, Article IV, Section 4
“Remember, democracy never lasts long. It soon wastes, exhausts and murders itself. There never was a democracy that did not commit suicide.” - John Adams
I believe that many people that do not vote are really voting “None of the Above”. Perhaps a constitutional amendment is needed so that the PEOPLE can reject the persons they do not trust, and then create a way of getting people on the ballot that the PEOPLE can support. The persons that have been rejected on the ballot would not be able to run for that office again. There also needs to be a way of providing real information on the candidates to the public. At one time that job was provided by a free press. With so many large corporate information providers buying up the different media and those corporations now having bottom lines that are investment oriented instead truthful information oriented, we get filtered information. The “Nixon” period is a prime example of what the press can and should do to help the PEOPLE know what is really going on. It has never been to our benefit to allow Big Business to take over the media. I believe that the main difference between our system and the oppressive systems is a free press and, and I believe we have lost that.
The founding fathers of our nation warned us that a democracy would only work with an intelligent electorate that knew and understood our constitution. This works for both federal and local levels. It appears to me that for the most part, too many voters are about as informed as the people on late night entertainment’s “Man on the street interview” subjects. Did you catch the documentary film maker’s video of voter interviews? People were more likely to know which candidate’s daughter was pregnant, than what party had been running congress for the last few years. Voters are not making political choices based on constitutional principles, but rather on mass media generated information. That is why we are moving toward socialism and a government controlled economy.
Alexeander Tyler, an 18th century history professor in Scotland, writing about the time of the revolutionary war, wrote that, ” A democracy is always a temporary in nature; it simply cannot exist as a permanent form of government. A democracy will continue to exist up until the time that voters discover that they can vote themselves generous gifts from the public treasury. From that moment on, the majority will always vote for the candidates who promise the most from the public treasury, with the result that every democracy will finally collapse due to loose fiscal policy, which is always followed by a dictatorship.”
We are at that moment. Medicare, medicade, Children’s insurance, welfare, wallstreet bailouts, government run volunteers, social security, autoworker’s bailout. Pork spending. Need I say more?
The founding fathers knew that government by the people and for the people had to have a balance between voters voting on emotion and those voting on common sense. We have shifted the balance in the last 100 years to the emotion side. The common sense side seems to have been lost on both major political parties. We used to be a nation of self reliant people, now too many of us expect the government to help us and save us. Freedom goes out the window with those thoughts. Taxes to pay for entitlements stifle econoomic growth. We are truly a nation lost from it’s principles and circling the drain of history in my opinion.
Solution? Teach in the schools the civics courses on the Constitution that have been lost for so many years. Understand the principles behind it. Teach the words and thoughts of Jefferson, Adams, Franklin. School children today do not even know what the Federalist Papers are, or what they were written to teach. Teach the Life and service of George Washington. He was the exemplar of the civil servant the founding fathers hoped for, but we no longer have. He was called up to serve his country on three occasions, and he served without compensation. He came out of retirement to serve as our first president because he felt the nation needed him. I challenge you to name more that a handfull of politicians who land in that category.
I have to leave for work now, I will post more thougthts at a later time. In passing, all of you who post here, a thought. Read the Unites States Contitution again. Study it, know the reasoning behind it. It will guide us from this current mess if we will uphold it’s principles once again.
An excellent video to provide background on the subject can be found at:
http://www.wimp.com/thegovernment/
This video describes, differentiates, and summarizes the different types of government that have existed in the world.
Frankly, “democracy” is not the solution to many of our problems. Our national, state, and local governments are all REPUBLICS, not democracies. They rule based on the laws already set in place (i.e. constitutions), and are governed by representatives elected by the people.
If we want to strengthen our FREEDOM (not our democracy), we need to educate people on the history and foundation of our government, not simply encourage uninformed people to vote on issues they do not understand. Once people understand what our government really is and how it was founded, they will naturally work, vote, and even run for office to keep our freedoms in tact.
I am not an expert, just a common citizen- I vote in every election, it is frustrating to listen to endless promises, go to the trouble to vote and then have to observe the status quo on the hill. I hear reform, reform and then when our legislators go to the hill- it is business as usual. There have been many polls about ethics reform and gifts- we are screaming for this to change- and still we go another year without any real reform. When our representatives really ‘represent’ us and not their own interests, you will see common citizens wanting to get involved. Why do they think that they need to be given a gift or food for information- I know that there is a lot of information to digest during a session, but why do the lobbies get more of their time than normal citizens- we do not have the time or the money to influence our representatives. We expect them to do their homework and think for themselves- and how their constituents would vote- that is who they are supposed to be voting for- not a guy in a nice suit with a gift or food.(or a former legislator/friend) It would be nice to get the money out of it altogether (I know I am dreaming)
I loved to be able to vote early, it was nice to be able not to stand in line for hours just to cast a vote. My time is valuable and it was nice to have several places to vote early.
My 2 cents worth is not going to go far when there are lobbyists giving much more than that for their opinion- Oh Well
The electoral college makes it so that the only way a Utahn can meaningfully participate in a presidential election is to have lots of money. If I devoted months to campaigning and changed the minds of 50,000 Utahns, it would not make the slightest bit of difference in our nation’s most important election. However if I could send large quantitites of money to swing states, then it could make a difference. In election 2000 if Gore would have got 530 more votes in Florida, the will of the American people would not have been thwarted.
The notion that the electoral college vote roughly equals the popular vote is a preposterous lie. In 1984 Mondale got 41% of the popular vote and that gave him 2% of the electoral college. In 1992 Clinton got 43% and that gave him 69% of electoral college. Thus Clinton’s extra 2% of the popular vote gave him an extra 67% of the electoral college.
I find it extremely disgusting that the most important election that I participate in is a rigged election. I have met people who have felt “used or violated” when they participate in our presidential elections. They avoid those emotions by not voting.
Lincoln said our nation was dedicated to the proposition that “all men are created equal”. The obvious corollary to that statement is that “all presidential votes should be created equal”. I hold the truth of the corollary to be self evident.
The two essential tasks obstructing progress toward a more representative and less corrupt legislature in Utah are facilitating non-partisan redistricting and passing serious ethical laws sanctioning conflicts of interest and self-dealing. It appears that the Republican legislature and the Governor recognize this clearly. As a result, the legislature has asked our Governor to have you ignore these two fundamental issues and Mr. Huntsman has happily complied.
This is entirely predictable and emblematic of the larger problem with politics and democracy in Utah.
I was astonished by the report in Iron County Today (August 6) that commissioners don’t see non-competitive one sided elections as part of the reason why election turnout is so low. After watching elections for the 5 years I’ve been in the state, it’s difficult for me to reach any other conclusion. It seems that the vast majority of contests pit the heavily favored candidate of the majority party (Republican in most places) against a sacrificial lamb nominated by the minority party (usually Democratic), and the result is almost never in doubt. It seems to me that as long as this state of affairs continues, election turnout is likely to continue to be low, but I also think there are some things that can be done to help open up the system:
1. Abolish voter registration by party (I’m told that in Utah, this is a relatively recent development anyway). Parties should decide for themselves whom to admit as members. The biggest problem with the status quo is that it accentuates dominant party situations by effectively disenfranchising voters who choose not to affiliate with the majority party.
2. Strip the parties of any official role in the nomination of candidates for elective office. Parties should be allowed to endorse whatever candidates they think proper (even if they’re not members of that party), but official procedures for registering candidates for elective office should be strictly nonpartisan.
3. Abolish state sponsored party primaries. As counterintuitive as this might sound, I have reached the conclusion that primaries actually reduce electoral competition by making electoral campaigns longer and more expensive, and by making major party nominations more valuable than they would be otherwise. They also make it harder to hold party leaders responsible for the success/failure of the party’s candidates., If a party wants to hold a primary, it can do it itself and employ its own officers to administer it. The filing deadline for candidate in the general election should not be any earlier than is necessary to insure that electoral materials are prepared in a timely fashion. I figure 30 days before the election is plenty of time.
4. Elect all officials either by majority vote (more than 50%) from single member constituencies, or by proportional representation from multi-member constituencies. The problem with plurality voting is that it discourages people from voting for independent or minor party candidates (even in contests where one party is heavily favored). It also encourages divide-and-conquer electoral strategies that end up undermining the legitimacy of the whole system. If a majority is required for election, people could vote for their favorite candidate on the first ballot and if no candidate gets a majority, a second ballot could be held between the top two vote getters (maybe a month later). This would encourage more candidates to run, offering voters a wider selection. Since I also advocate abolishing state-sponsored primaries, the cost to the taxpayers for holding runoff elections would be at least partially offset by the money saved by not holding primaries.
The intended effect of the first three measures is to create an officially nonpartisan system of elections. Parties would still be able fill their proper function as advocacy organizations, but could only serve as gatekeepers to the extent that voters trust them to do so. It might even make sense to allow candidates to display a party label on the ballot, if they are members of that party in good standing, but it should signify affiliation and maybe an endorsement; nothing else. By eliminating plurality elections, it would make it easier for independent or third party candidates to compete against dominant party candidates if the “official opposition” declines to seriously contest the seat. One might even see situations where the two finalists are members of the same party, but I think this is still preferable to a race in which the nominee of the majority party faces only nominal opposition, which happens here and elsewhere far too often.
I’m glad to see the issue being discussed. Good luck in your work.
A brief response to the “republic, not democracy” people: All you say may be correct, but can anyone honestly say that the existing system is one that’s ever likely to encourage the best citizens to seek and hold elective office? Or even that it’s likely to inspire the confidence of the people in whose name the politicians govern (remembering that the consent of the governed is the basis of all legitimate government)? Does it promote honest government? Is a de facto one party state really what the Founding Fathers, or even the framers of the Utah Constitution had in mind (remembering that the former abhorred partisan politics almost to a man)?
I humbly submit that the existing system has become indefensible, even by people that abhor the term “democracy” and all that it stands for, and have no interest whatever in broader citizen participation. We can and should do better. Say “strengthen our republic” if it makes you feel better, but quibbling over terminology does nothing to improve the system. Concrete proposals would work much better.
The way things are in Utah right now, it is a given that the Republican will win. There is no need for a Republican leaning voter to go to the polls, because his candidate will win anyway. There is no reason for a Democrat leaning voter to bother voting because his candidate will lose anyway. That is absolutely bottom-line why voter turnout is so low.
And yeah, yeah, yeah, I know we are a republic, not a democracy…we all know that. The word democracy is just being used as a shorthand way of expressing the idea that the people ought to have a small say in how their government is operated.
Three additional comments and I’m done…
1. I’m understand that vacancies in the Legislature are filled by the parties of the departed members, instead of by their constituents. To me, this is completely unacceptable, as it’s one more factor contributing to making elected officials more accountable to their parties than to the voters. All legislative vacancies should be filled by special election, just as those to the U.S. House of Representatives are.
2. Legislative officers should be elected on a secret ballot by majority vote, so that they’re chosen by the members at large, instead of just the majority party caucus. This would encourage such officers to act in a less partisan manner, since they would not know exactly who voted for them. Let the majority and minority leaders be partisan, while the President and Speaker impartially enforce the rules and act in the interests of all citizens, rather than the majority only.
3. In a previous post, I mentioned proportional representation and do believe it could help remedy the one sided nature of elections in this state (even in majority Democratic areas like Salt Lake City). This could be done without having voters select party slates rather than individual candidates (I oppose slate voting as it makes candidates primarily responsible to their parties), either by having them rank candidates in order of preference (Single Transferable Vote), or by having them vote without ranking the candidates; the rankings instead being based on the number of persons voting for each candidate (I’ve written a proposal for this which I hope to publish soon). One possibility would be to elect the State Senate from single member districts by majority vote, with a runoff if necessary; and the State House from multimember districts by proportional representation (this would require an amendment to the state constitution, of course). As is done in some other states, there could be a single set of districts for both: 1 Senator from each of 29 districts (as at present), and 7 Representatives from each of those same districts. This would increase the size of the House from 75 to 145, which is large for a western state, but well within the norm nationally. One of the advantages to electing Senators and Representatives from the same districts is that it makes it harder to customize districts to suit the political interests of particular members. Also, increasing the number of seats in the House might make the proposal a bit more palatable to Representatives who would thus not be expected to sacrifice their political careers for the sake of creating a more representative body (makes it more likely to happen).
Proportional representation would also help to insure that all parts of the state are represented in the caucuses of both major parties, helping to alleviate the problems of regional and sectarian polarization and increasing the probability that voters will have a genuine choice of candidates throughout the state.
As to the reason the public turn out to vote so low…….is that there is very little trust in the procee, but moreover the results.
The Status quu is the eventually results. We all know that the deck is staked against the elected official that is really for the people.
There is deep sociopathic infrastructure in place that innately prevents the will of the people from being the proiorty of the day.
Perhaps a simple suggestion to encourage more people to vote would be to create a voting holiday. Many people I know have very hectic lives and, while they care about issues, they have difficulty making it to polling locations. Employers are not always sympathetic to this issue. People who vote are fulfilling a civic responsibility. Why not make it just a bit more logistically easier for them? I realize that this may be a challenge to apply - but I think it is possible to make it happen and make it fair for all people.
Thomas Jefferson and many early education reformers knew the value of teaching our young citizens about democracy. It was one of the main purposes of public education and should still be. We have the ears and minds of our future democracy before us. As a teacher it is my responsibility to build the democracy. By educating teachers and by creating a strong program that promotes an understanding and respect for the country we live in and that empowers our children to understand the precious gifts of the constitution, we can build a strong voice in Utah for Democracy.